The Bible NETWork ~ Impacting the World for Christ one post at a time!

We should not expect non-believers to act like believers! The church is not responsible to enforce a moral code on those outside the church...Cobra's application is creative, but it is fairly far removed from the context of the statement.

Sorry, Cobra, but the Apostle Paul does not make your case for you.

In 1 Corinthians 14 Paul gave the church instructions on how to properly exercise spiritual gifts in the church assembly, wherever that might be...

If you will not see that Paul is telling the people of the church to care about how the unbelievers perceive their assembly, I can't convince you. But it is there.

Now did I say Paul didn't tell the church to care about how unbelievers perceived their assembly? Or did I say that his concern was that unbelievers might be alienated on account of the church acting out of wrong motives and doing things God did not want them to do, rather than on account of doing things God had commanded them to do?

perhaps a look to the past of the start of our nation's path to the future is proper,

Charles Stanley hosted David Barton of Wallbuilders.com to give a history lesson the 50 minute video is well worth the 50 minutes. It has profoundly changed my views and in concert with this posting may be of benefit to all. It is amazing how far we have come and how far away from God's moral laws we have looked the other way. ...

Is President Obama Correct: Is America No Longer a Christian Nation? by David Barton - http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesAr ... p?id=23909

God did not command the organized church to enforce Christian morals on unbelievers or to create political action committees.

Cobra, are you still protesting that we lack explicit commands to do something that wasn't even a possibility when the the NT was written?

Luke 19: "For the Son of Man came to seek out and to save the lost."

John 12: "Whoever believes in me believes not in me but in him who sent me. And whoever sees me sees him who sent me. I have come as light into the world, so that everyone who believes in me should not remain in the darkness. I do not judge anyone who hears my words and does not keep them, for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. The one who rejects me and does not receive my word has a judge; on the last day the word that I have spoken will serve as judge, for I have not spoken on my own, but the Father who sent me has himself given me a commandment about what to say and what to speak. And I know that his commandment is eternal life. What I speak, therefore, I speak just as the Father has told me."

4) The church, the one from the first definition, is filled with believers who are called to do good works and who are called to be the salt and the light of this earth. That church, the one from the first definition, can and should, as Andy Stanley said, “keep God in the center of the conversation.” The preaching from item 2 above should spur the church, the one from the first definition, to influence society for good. And individual believers doing this work will be more effective with this mission. The ones God calls to this work will be more effective than the ones the pastor calls over the pulpit. And the church, the one from the second definition, will be left to do its important work – not creating a society with laws to decrease sin but creating new hearts with the desire to decrease sin.

...and the leader of the Civil Rights movement was not a politician. What was he? He was a preacher. Before he was Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. he was Reverand King and from pulpits all over this country people cried out against laws and against restrictions because they were unjust. And why were they unjust? Because men were created free. Because we believe in a creator and we believe the creator and a belief in the creator should impact the laws of the United States of America... Andy Stanley in his webmessage titled: "God & Country: Law and All" Time stamp 22:48-23:41(underlining by me for emphasis)

Quote:
…To remove God from the political discussion and to remove God from the national discussion is extraordinarily, extraordinarily, dangerous. We really have very little idea of where that will lead unless we look at where it’s lead other nations. We can’t afford to allow God disappear from the national conversation because to do so will leave us in a place where we’re not able to be grateful to anyone but ourselves. And that will lead to arrogance. We can’t afford to allow God to disappear from the national conversation because that will aleve(iate) us being accountable to no one but ourselves. And that will result to even more injustice. We can’t allow God to disappear from the national conversation because it will continue to erode our national conscience and that would lead to more moral ambiguity. And we can’t allow God to disappear from the political and national conversation because eventually that will erode our civil rights.
You see, the most sensitive thing we could do – the most sensitive thing we could do for people who don’t believe in God - is to keep God in the center of the conversation. Because it is his presence and it is our intuitive accountability to him that enables us and gives us the leverage to create a system, where everyone who chooses not to believe, will always have the freedom not to believe. So at whatever level you have influence on our society as a government leader, as a civil leader, as a leader in a neighborhood, as Congressmen, as Senators, as Mayors, as Governors, as President - whoever it is - this is not the time to loose heart. This is not the time to loose our nerve. This is not the time to be afraid…. . Andy Stanley in his webmessage titled: "God & Country: Law and All" Time stamp 27:15-29:23(underlining & bolding by me for emphasis)

Those who read or listen to Andy's sermon and think it is saying the organized church should have political action committees to push the enactment of laws to subject unbelievers to Christian morals have mislead themselves.

No, I have shown scripture which says this is not a role of the organized church -- you just interpret it differently or reject it.

Of course, you are ignoring all the words I said about the work of individual Christians in this area. This is rather disingenuous of you.