The Bible NETWork ~ Impacting the World for Christ one post at a time!

Paco wrote{
Correct. Continue to learn patiently and be born again by the imperishable seed, through the living and enduring word of God.1 Peter 1:23

Theophilus wrote:
Agree, we can receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit if you could apprehend the meaning of “as I began to speak. The Holy Spirit fell on us at the beginning” which is relevant of being born again from above.
1 Peter 1:23; James 1:18,21; Acts 2:4

1 John 2:7,24 7 Dear friends, I am not writing a new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word that you have already heard. 24 As for you, what you have heard from the beginning must remain in you. If what you heard from the beginning remains in you, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. Context (NET)

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

Paul wrote to the Ephesians:
“There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and father of all who is above all, and through all, and in you all.” Eph. 4:46
Notice that Paul says there is only "one" baptism. Paul is our apostle. The baptism of John (water) is for Israel. The Baptism in the Holy Spirit (Pentacost) is dispensation for Israel. Under the gospel of grace, we can do nothing. Just as God put Abraham to sleep, so too, God does the baptizing for us.

Billyboy347 wrote:
Welcome to the forum.

Can you give biblical support with your allegation that water baptism and baptism in Holy Spirit are dispensation for Israel only?

This is contrary to what is written in Matthew 28:19-20 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age.

Acts 2:38 Peter said to them, “Repent, and each one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

Which scripture says this? Acts 19:4 still has water baptism being "a baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus." Which verse after this redefines water baptism to make it an outward sign?

i'll quibble with this -- the baptism of repentence is John's baptism, not water baptism in general -- this is what Appollos knew so that's all he taught (Acts 18:25)

the folks in Acts 19:1 were not Saved until Paul expounded on what they already knew

as far as i know (& i've no desire to run it down in a concordance tonight), water baptism's only role is to obey a Commandment & publically align ourselves with Him -- hence, Yahweh1's comment

[As paul stated, the water Baptism symbolizes in visible fashionthe inward work of the Holy Spirit...

We have been saved by God thru Jesus, seal and filled with His Spirit, and the rite of baptism is an external sign to testify to that, we are making a public declaration for Christ!

that public identification was used as the means to have a person submit to a local assembly/church body...

Thanks. Which specific scripture says this? "As paul stated, the water Baptism symbolizes in visible fashionthe inward work of the Holy Spirit..."

And the nowhere is the scripture for this" the rite of baptism is an external sign to testify to that, we are making a public declaration for Christ!

that public identification was used as the means to have a person submit to a local assembly/church body...and scripture for this?

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

The early Church ONLY administered the 2 ordiances of water baptism and Lord Supper, and both were done by/to already professing Chrsitians!

the Baptism was done to have a public declaration of faith in yeshua...

You keep repeating public declaration in various wording. I understand that you think that water baptism is an outward sign.

I want to know if there is any scripture to say this. Please quote a scriptural reference that changes water baptism to an outward sign/public declaration.

you will not find a verse that says, "immerse the new Christian in water as this is baptism & thus an outward sign to all..." -- but so what? -- the Scriptural examples portray this -- that's enough for me but apparently not for you -- that's fine

are there verses that claim it is not an "outward sign"?

to me, Christians can take the role of baptism off the reservation like Israel took circumcision -- both were Commanded by God, yet neither Saved

chapter 6 Roamns addresses why we are water baptized into jesus, for thru His death and resurrection us going down in the water and rising up symbolizes what he did for us!

Paco wrote:[quote[are there verses that claim it is not an "outward sign"?[/quote]
Why do you turn the burden of proof to Theophilus who are asking for scriptural reference instead to the one who first pronounced “that changes water baptism to an outward sign/public declaration”.
Yahweh wrote:
Perhaps you mean Romans 6:3-5 if, I am correct you study its context and you will not find there even a drop of water. I admit that said verses is relevant for regeneration and sanctification of a believer,through the glory of the Father which raised Christ from dead, but not for water baptism.

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

am not in a debate -- i asked a reasonable Q -- so did he -- as i stated, i do not think a verse proclaims an answer -- i infer from the examples that it is what i said it was -- others are free to disagree

i agree -- however, i see why some use this Text but water may not be implied here -- if i had to pick a side, i'd say water is not implied

Paco,
Thanks for clarification.

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7