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Thanks that we have agreement about resurrection, but this pertain only to those intended that were dead at the time of resurrection. 1 Corinthians 15:52-53

Scriptures manifested in Luke 9:27 But I tell you of a truth, There are some of them that stand here, who shall in no wise taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.

Behold, I tell you a mystery: We all shall not sleep, but we shall all be changed, 1 Corinthians 15:51

The ultimate purpose for resurrection is for us to learn enough lessons and gain enough experience from Earth lives to earn salvation and be resurrected to inherit and live in eternity in God’s kingdom in heaven. Like a graduation. Resurrection is not the goal because some will be resurrected for life and many will be resurrected for condemnation in hell.
Eternal life means never having to die anymore. That is the goal - overcoming death and rebirth. Resurrection is the method and means to attain this goal ‘eternal life’.
And this is life eternal, that they should know thee the only true God, and him whom thou didst send, even Jesus Christ. John 17:3
He that hath the Son hath the life; he that hath not the Son of God hath not the life. These things have I written unto you, that ye may know that ye have eternal life, even unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God.
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
1 John 5:12-13, 20 (ASV)

What are your thoughts?

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

Learn enough lessons and gain experience? This sounds like Gnositicism to me. The resurrection of the body is the hope so that we can inherit the promise of the kingdom.

11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end: 12 That ye be not slothful, but followers of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises. 13 For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself, 14 Saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee, and multiplying I will multiply thee. 15 And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise. 16 For men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife. 17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: {confirmed...: Gr. interposed himself by} 18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us: 19 Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; 20 Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
(Heb 6:1 KJV)

Butch5 wrote:

Agree, that it was the body resurrection which is the way to achieve our destination to inherit the kingdom of God, "For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly [physical, material] body that it may be conformed to His glorious body" (Philippians 3:20-21; compare 2 Corinthians 5:1-5

Why do you call to learn enough and gain experience of our life and faith while on earth sound like Gnosticism? Was it not written in John 8:32 and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Is knowing the truth Gnosticism?

About the resurrection of the dead, written in Mark 12:24-25 Jesus said unto them, Is it not for this cause that ye err, that ye know not the scriptures, nor the power of God?
v.25)For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as angels in heaven.

So, if this is the case, who shall perform the continuity of mankind, hence they were not allowed to marry any more. And how could the promise made to Abraham, I will bless thee, and multiply thee would continue if they were not to marry any more? How could the prophesy on Isaiah be fulfill?

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

Hi V,

Gnosticism taught that it was through special knowledge that one gained entrance into the heavens. Through learning and experiences one could gain knowledge and then at death they could use this knowledge to ascend through the heavens.

Regarding the promise to Abraham, it is not through marriage that God fulfilled the promise. The seed that God spoke of was Jesus.

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. 15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. {covenant: or, testament} 16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. 18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise. (Gal 3:1 KJV)

The promise to Abraham included the promised land as an Eternal inheritance to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Abraham has never received that land yet, but God promised it to him for an everlasting possession.

KJV Acts 7:1 Then said the high priest, Are these things so? 2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Charran, 3 And said unto him, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and come into the land which I shall shew thee. 4 Then came he out of the land of the Chaldaeans, and dwelt in Charran: and from thence, when his father was dead, he removed him into this land, wherein ye now dwell. 5 And he gave him none inheritance in it, no, not so much as to set his foot on: yet he promised that he would give it to him for a possession, and to his seed after him, when as yet he had no child. (Act 7:1 KJV)

(Genesis 13:15 KJV) For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.
(Genesis 17:8 KJV) And I[b] will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession[/b]; and I will be their God.

Isaac blesses jacob
(Genesis 28:4 KJV) And give thee the blessing of Abraham, to thee, and to thy seed with thee; that thou mayest inherit the land wherein thou art a stranger, which God gave unto Abraham.

The Promise to Jacob
(Genesis 28:13 KJV) And, behold, the LORD stood above it, and said, I am the LORD God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed;
(Genesis 35:12 KJV) And the land which I gave Abraham and Isaac, to thee I will give it, and to thy seed after thee will I give the land.

(Galatians 3:16 KJV) Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

The land was promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and their seed which is Christ as Paul says. The prophecy in Isaiah is the restored earth which is the fulfillment of the promise to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Butch5 wrote:

I do not understand this special knowledge, whatever you meant in regards to Gnosticism.


Yes ,I agree that the seed promise is Christ Galatians 3:16 but there were also promised that his descendant will be like star. And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and number the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be. Gen 15:5 & Romans 9:27

However your quote is seem evading and getting away through trickery to our topic about the after thoughts of resurrection wherein man is raised with glorified body which will no longer subject for marriage (Mark 12:24-25) so, if we are already liken to angel, and if what is the future of mankind which God first created according to his image and likeness to have power over all his creation in earth? And how could Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob plus their descendant inherit the promise land if we now abode in eternity? Where is the fulfillment of Isaiah 65:17-25.

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

I had always thought of Is 65 as part of the Millennial reign not eternity, but I have not looked into end times all that much.

Hi Theophilus,

It is, but the land was promised to Abraham and his Seed as an everalsting possession. Paul said that seed was Christ. The creation is Jesus' inheritance, Psalm 2 states this as does Hebrews 1.

KJV Psalm 2:1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? {rage: or, tumultuously assemble} {imagine: Heb. meditate}
2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying,
3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.
4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.
5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure. {vex: or, trouble}
6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion. {set: Heb. anointed} {upon...: Heb. upon Zion, the hill of my holiness}
7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. {the decree: or, for a decree}
8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession. 9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.
10 Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth.
11 Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling.
12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him. (Psa 2:1-12 KJV)

KJV Hebrews 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; (Heb 1:1-2 KJV)

Hi V,

I'm not trying to avoid your question, but rather to answer it. God told Abraham his descendents would be as the stars in the sky. Paul is saying that it is through Christ that this promise is fulfilled. All of those who are believers are Abraham's seed.

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. (Gal 3:27-29 KJV)

The Land promised to Abraham is what Isaiah 65 and 66 is talking about. The new earth or land is the fulfillment of the land promised to Abraham as an "Everlasting" possession. When the earth is renewed, as in Isaiah 65-66 the land promised to Abraham in Genesis will be given to him.

Butch5 wrote:


OK, so you mean to say that Abraham will inherit the land of promised as an Everlasting possession when the time comes that the earth is renewed;
Nowhere do you think the land of promised to Abraham located? Or was this promise land still a subject to be created as part of new heaven and new earth, reason why it was swore since period of Genesis and up to present times and Israel were unable to possessed it.

I would once again clarify our point of view as an after thought of resurrection where Abraham and all his seeds has already been resurrected and liken to an angel where they are not allowed for marriage and destined to live in eternity.

How could there be an infant to be born if marriage are not allowed? Isaiah 65:20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days; for the child shall die a hundred years old, and the sinner being a hundred years old shall be accursed. (ASV)

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How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! Isaiah 52:7

Will be patterned after Body of the resurrected Christ!
Will not be a ghost form, as jesus said that he was 'flesh and blood", and was able to eat...
Will be physical body that will never perish/age/sick!

Will be patterned after Body of the resurrected Christ!
Will not be a ghost form, as jesus said that he was 'flesh and blood", and was able to eat...
Will be physical body that will never perish/age/sick![/quote]

[/quote]


Correct, except Jesus was not "flesh and blood" but "flesh and bones" after his resurrection. (Luke 24:39)

thanks for the correction, that is what happens when quoting from memory!

THE SOUL IS ETERNAL, so too the SPIRIT,
thus they have no need for resurrection, yet the promise of
resurrection speaks more than just flesh, but to the restoration of
mites basically to a refreshed state.

It's like this- When you shut down your computer, does the lack of it running
denote that it is dead, or just asleep, waiting to be restored-resurrected?
Now there is death and there is death as not to be dead.
JESUS never noted anyone as being DEAD, but asleep
And this predates even the writings of any of the BOOK-or BOOX.

Question thus must be asked, Why was Jesus sent?
Why was Moses sent? Why was Jonah sent, why was Muhammad sent, why
was Zarathustra sent, why did Buddha travel-hence also sent/
If you can answer that, then you need to ask the next question
Why did those programs-programmers not stick or did they stick and why did
they become corrupted?

PAX