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guykickinit:

So what do you think of the point, above, that if a visitor is in a nice swimsuit, then it might be advisable for one's wife to be in one, too?

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Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

Well, If my wife wishes to wear a swimsuit; that is her prerogative. I, on the same note make the effort to look elsewhere, rather than watch other women. Having my wife in a swimsuit doesn't make it okay to look someone else's swimsuit.
No matter what my wife wears, it's not okay to watch other women. It's just not right.
My wife is the flower of my garden which deserves all my attention.

There's my 2 cents

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guykickinit:

Yes, I can understand and agree with your two cents'.

Ty.

_________________
Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

guykickinit:

PS: I would add that in comparison with some stringy creations which are nominally one pieces, there are some bikinis which are actually more modest.

But I agree with what you say, indeed.

_________________
Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

Maybe we should go back to the 1920s bathing suits so that men won't be enticed.

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

Well, I guess there is cleavage and cleavage. Plenty of decent, godly women happen to show a bit, from time to time. Hard to avoid, but no need to stare.

(Two cents'.)

_________________
Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

If we were to do as Bluesman suggests, why not go Puritan, or Amish. But consider this; Men must adhere to whatever style or fashion they are going to ask Women to do. I mean if we're going there. Hey, could be a good idea. I'm game if society is, right?
Best to reflect on the biblical standard and everyone: just dress in a way that does not provoke or stumble your neighbor.
I realize that society is not going to adhere to this way, so If going to the beach is going to cause you to gawk at a women, then don't go to that beach, find a visually safe one. Does a person who has been set free of the bondage of alcohol go to bars? That would be genocide to that persons walk.
We can't just go walking anywhere our feet go, we must walk with purpose. If I let my feet lead me, I'll be swept away by the first worldly wind that comes. With purpose choose the route that avoids a known stumbling block. Don't walk down that street or drive that road. How many times must we step in the same puddle before we decide to take a different path.
May the spirit lead you.

_________________

_____________________________________________________
Forum Code of Conduct
The Bible NETWork Doctrinal Statement
http://www.answersingenesis.org/

Sorry, man. But the very idea...who is that advice going to fly with?

I've never met a guy who wanted to avoid looking at women or being in their presence.

Part of the reason I go to the beach is to "gawk at women". The more women that are there, the better! I don't consider girl-watching a sin. God gave me two good eyes and he gave women attractive bodies. There's a difference between observing women and being rude.

Also, I know for a fact (LOL) that many women like to check out men.

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

b: Not a good idea.

_________________
Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

When you "gawk" do you also lust?

Matthew 5:27-29 27 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to desire her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away! It is better to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into hell. Context (NET)

The prudent person sees approaching danger and shields himself from it (Prov 27:12).

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Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brothers to dwell together in unity!

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Well, yes, I have to admit that sometimes I do. But even when I don't conscously lust, sometimes my body responds on its own -- physiological changes, you know.

And yes, I'm familiar with the Matthew verses. I find them to be very "difficult" and very troubling. I don't think Jesus was actually preaching self-mutilation.



I agree. But what is "danger"? (I've known some dangerous women but I didn't know they were dangerous until it was too late.)

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

No he wasn't preaching self-mutilation. But he was teaching us to handle our sinful character quite radically. Part of that would be to avoid places which would encourage us to lust.


The physical reaction is more than just sub-conscience IMO. The body is following the mind. Even if it is subconscious (which IMO is laughable) it is no less adultery and, thus, sinful. Not all dangers are harmful physically

Proverbs 9:14-18 14 So she sits at the door of her house, on a seat at the highest point of the city, 15 calling out to those who are passing by her in the way, who go straight on their way. 16 “Whoever is simple, let him turn in here,” she says to those who lack understanding. 17 “Stolen waters are sweet, and food obtained in secret is pleasant!” 18 But they do not realize that the dead are there, that her guests are in the depths of the grave. Context (NET)

James 1:14-15 14 But each one is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desires. 15 Then when desire conceives, it gives birth to sin, and when sin is full grown, it gives birth to death. Context (NET)

We should all take heed of Proverbs 7 especially the ending

Proverbs 7:22-27 22 Suddenly he went after her like an ox that goes to the slaughter, like a stag prancing into a trapper’s snare 23 till an arrow pierces his liver – like a bird hurrying into a trap, and he does not know that it will cost him his life. 24 So now, sons, listen to me, and pay attention to the words I speak. 25 Do not let your heart turn aside to her ways – do not wander into her pathways; 26 for she has brought down many fatally wounded, and all those she has slain are many. 27 Her house is the way to the grave, going down to the chambers of death. Context (NET)

Blessings,
Randy

I can only speak for myself, so to answer your questions;
1. Me
2. You are right, we haven't met.
My wife is the ONLY women I want to look at or be in the presence of.

_________________

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http://www.answersingenesis.org/

guykickinit:

'Fixing' the externals still doesn't take care of the heart, does it?

In the end, any amount of external fixing falls far short of the transforming power of the Gospel.

_________________
Read the Bible prayerfully.For a wealth of sound theology, go to John 3:16.
(My wife and I are very much in love, by the way.)
I don't like extremes of temperature. I don't like extremes among preachers. People maybe think I'm extreme.But never mind about me
A true Christian is different, and the world will notice the difference.Even your tattoo, if it's faith related, it's different!

Very true, but until someone dealing with the issue has been delivered from that particular sin, Since we are human, one has a better chance of walking the straight and narrow hanging out with Nuns, rather than hanging out at the magazine rack. Just because I'm saved, doesn't mean the opportunities aren't out there or that we are miraculously shielded from the influences of this world. I must pray for the indwelling of the spirit daily, for his mercy and grace to guide my feet, my hands and my eyes. Devouring the Word helps to equip one with the armor of God as spoken of in Ephesians 6:10-18. One who puts on the Armor is better equipped to steer clear of such temptation. Chivalry is not dead, its just sleeping. Having put on the Helmet of the Word, and the shield of faith to stop the incoming whispering darts of the adversary, Shoes of the Gospel of grace and the breastplate of righteousness, we can stand firm in faith when temptation is thrust in our face, and turn aside from falling at the hands of the wayward women, offering a covering and stay on the path, which is narrow.

_________________

_____________________________________________________
Forum Code of Conduct
The Bible NETWork Doctrinal Statement
http://www.answersingenesis.org/