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So, how about it guys (and gals)...how do you deal with coveting?

If I understand the meaning of the word, it is to lust after or desire something that isn't yours.

I will admit right off the bat that I have a terrible, terrible time with this commandment. Here's the problem: "coveting" is a physiological response that you cannot control. We were designed to covet. Isn't that what motivates us (and all sentient beings) to reproduce? And so we have sexual desires to "facilitate" this process.

My problem is that if I have a conversation, or even stand next to an attractive woman, I find myself (both my mind and my body) coveting. And I'm sure most of you guys are the same. Now, I rarely, if ever, have followed through on such sinful desires, but it's not just the "follow-through" that's a sin, is it? It's the coveting! How can one stop coveting?

Sometimes I think I'm destined for the lake of fire.

[Note: any ladies out there who are interested or feel they can contribute are perfectly welcome to participate in this discussion.]

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Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

Hi bluesman,

Are you sure you aren't confusing temptation (which is not a sin) with covetousness (which is a sin)?

Ask yourself: Are you resisting the temptation or are you looking/hoping for an opportunity to fulfill it?

Is flirting covetousnous?

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Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

With regard to your initial question, responding physiologically to something you cannot control is not necessarily coveting. You may not have a choice about being confronted with a woman in revealling attire, but you do have a choice about where your eyes and thoughts are directed as a result. "You can't prevent the birds from flying overhead, but you can prevent them from building a nest in your hair."

As to your second question, I would say flirting is normal "premating ritual" in our culture and is not necessarily covetous. If you are single and hoping to find a spouse, flirting might be appropriate (though some might take issue with this approach for a Christian seeking a spouse). If you are married and flirting with one who is not your spouse, it may be lying (pretending an availability which is not true) or it may be an attempt to find someone with whom you might conduct an illicit affair. If you are single and are not looking to find a spouse, but rather a noncommitted sexual relationship, it is not "coveting" but it is sinful, at least in my book.

Regards.

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All Scripture quotations are New American Standard Bible, unless otherwise indicated.

That depends. What is the intention behind it? Plus, might it lead the other party into sin or cause them embarrasment?

Very good question. I had to think about it...

Have you ever heard the expression, "I don't trust myself?"

Given the opportunity, I think most men take it, whether they admit to it up front or not.

That still doesn't answer your question, I know...

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

Yes, I've heard the expression. In which case, resistance means not allowing oneself to get into a situation where the temptation might become too great.

I agree that many (if not most) men (and many women) would take the opportunity. But most also aren't Christians, with the benefit of God's graces to resist temptation.

As you know, Jesus tells us it's not the act, but the intent that matters (Matthew 5:28). Another way of looking at this is to express Jesus' statement as: "If, given the opportunity, you would commit adultery with the woman concerned, then you are already sinning". That's what 'lust' means in this context.

Someone gave me this advice - "look once, but don't look twice".

I have found that glancing at attractive women for too much or too long feeds the flesh and kicks my system into high gear. After going through Song of Songs I've started to notice that man has a weak spot for looks (while woman has a weak spot for touch).

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Studying MDiv. (Biblical Studies) at Tyndale Seminary
My Pastor's testimony "Street Kid to Preacher" - http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p ... 1A10FF286C

Notwithstanding the verse from Matthew, are you saying that thinking about having an affair is worse than actually having one?

That doesn't make sense to me.

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

So, we all agree that lust is sin. Lust is by nature a form of "time consuming" thoughts, some would say obsession. A great example of that would be the 7th commandment - Thou shalt not commit adultery (Exodus 20:14). Isn't this just the fruition of lust as described in James 1:15?

How to avoid lust? Focus more on what God tells us. No, I'm not saying it's easy to do. How? Obey Matthew 22:37.

We can't leave out Exodus 20:17 though. It's interesting how 1 Timothy 6:7-9 illustrates it well and also Romans 7:7. They appear to address your question directly, which leads us to loving God more than ourselves (Matthew 22:37). It certainly is a battle to say the least.

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"I have been driven many times to my knees by the overwhelming conviction that I had no where else to go. My own wisdom, and that of all about me, seemed insufficient for the day." ~Abraham Lincoln

I don't have will power like that. I admit that I am weak.

Don't quote me on this (but I think I'm correct): humans are the only mammalian species to exhibit secondary sex characteristics (breasts) full time after puberty. So God essentially made women physically attractive to look at at all times.

You too, huh?

Men have been shown to respond more strongly to visual stimuli than women do, while women respond more to intangibles such as emotional sensitivity and perceived ability to provide food, shelter, protection, etc.

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14

The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. In our own strength we are all weak and incapable of overcoming sin, but it is God who is working in us, engendering in us the desire to please him and then enabling us to do so. Only in reliance upon the Spirit of Christ in us can we hope to be overcomers. But there are disciplines we can practice which effectively strengthen our inner man — disciplines that rely on the grace of God and build us up in our most holy faith.

In Romans 12:2, Paul tells us that we are not to be conformed to the ways of this world, but we are to be transformed by the renewing of our mind. Scientists have learned that our thought patterns become physically ingrained in our brains and the more we repeat a thought pattern the bigger the pathway becomes. Thought patterns repeated over and over become like superhighways in the brain so that thoughts very easily follow those paths. Thought patterns are repeated with increasing ease to the point that they become almost automatic. Even from a physiological perspective we can see the importance of thinking right thoughts and avoiding wrong thoughts. Practicing thinking right thoughts and not wrong thoughts.

While we are practicing thinking right thoughts, it is important that we avoid repeating wrong thinking. When we catch ourselves going down the wrong path, we have the power to choose a different path. We can turn to God in prayer. We can begin reflecting on the word of God. We choose the paths we walk, and we choose the thoughts we think. And in this regard it is important that we use wisdom in choosing our entertainment. Watching and listening to stuff that trivializes or even exalts sin can only affect us negatively.

Getting back to the disciplines I mentioned earlier, one of the most important things we can do to renew our minds—our way of thinking—is to study, meditate upon, and speak the word of God. Regular Bible study, scripture memorization, reflective thinking, and sharing God's word with others will strengthen us spiritually if we will do them. We need to be regularly "washed by the water of the word" to keep our thought life pure. And of course we need to do these things in an attitude of prayer, looking to God to cleanse us and change us and make us more like Jesus. Prayer, in fact, is another spiritual discipline that we need to practice if we hope to be successful Christians.

In every other aspect of life we recognize the need for discipline. If a man wants to be a successful athlete, doctor, soldier, or writer he knows that he must be disciplined in the pursuit of his objective. He's got to get up every morning and go to school, go to work, report for duty, etc. If a man wants to be successful at anything he does in life, he has to work at it. Practice, practice, practice! Success in life requires discipline. And success as a Christian requires discipline.

Discipline means hard work, but hard work is what we men are born to. As men, we respect other men who are disciplined, work hard, and excel at what they do. We have little regard for sluggards. Discipline is a manly thing (not that women can't practice it). And if our careers which will last only a few years in this life are worthy of our discipline and hard work, how much more is the high calling of God in Christ Jesus (which is eternal) worthy of our sweat?

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Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brothers to dwell together in unity!

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I think evangelical Christians tend to go overboard on this topic. I think Jesus wanted to point out that you couldn't stop sinning for a week if your life depended on it. We are fallen and we can't get up... I see the action (adultery) as much worse than fantasy, however, precautions are reasonable. For Example, congressman
Paul never travels alone with his secretary. One should not even give the appearance of impropriety. You can't really function well in today's enforced unisex culture if you are pursuing advanced discipleship. Well, at least it's not easy.

I really admire the Mennonites for at least trying. Unfortunately, I think it ultimately fails and degenerates into legalism.
The women wear head covers and simple dresses from another century; but they wear Nike running shoes at Walmart and drive off in expensive late model cars and vans.


Pax

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Behold, now is "THE ACCEPTABLE TIME,"
behold, now is "THE DAY OF SALVATION" --
The apostle Paul, NASB

Gideon,
Great post. Some good ideas to aim for. I'm not very disciplined myself though, although Jesus helps me in many ways.



Pax

_________________
Behold, now is "THE ACCEPTABLE TIME,"
behold, now is "THE DAY OF SALVATION" --
The apostle Paul, NASB

Thank you, Gideon. I appreciate your post. Your words make a lot of sense.

Mental discipline is something I have very little of. I sometimes tend to overthink things and focus on things that I shouldn't be focusing on.

I read an article recently that said psychologists are finding that rumination is a common characteristic of people who are depressed. Thinking unconstructive thoughts really serves no useful purpose, but it's something I've alway been very good at.

_________________
Some say Jesus was not a pacifist...

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."
Matthew 26:52 (NIV)

For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.
Galatians 5:14