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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 4:53 am 
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For me, the Gospel of John is not Christianity 101.
Some people find it to be the most spiritual and love it. For years I found it the most obscure and remote. I have been scientifically trained, have been very literal and logical in my thinking. Only in the last few years have I become comfortable with what might be described as supra-rational thinking. Perhaps at last I am free enough to let my feet leave the ground and perhaps be a bit mystical, and its message is now getting through to me and a light is turning on.
It certainly suits a different mode of thinking. I have heard that it expresses the Gospel in a way that would be understandable for those used to a Gnostic way of thinking. I am not saying that it is Gnostic. I am trying to illustrate that the different Gospels suit different people and John may not be the best introduction for everyone.
In fact, my view is that each of the Gospels was written to suit the needs of different audiences and that it is illuminating to see how they differ. The simplest example is that of The Lord's Prayer in Matthew and Luke. Matthew is speaking to Jewish Christians who know well how to pray and tend to go overboard, so the Lord's Prayer is given as a an example of KISS (Keep It Short and Simple). By contrast, Luke is encouraging his church not to lose faith and encourages them to keep praying. He presents The Lord's prayer as Praying 101. This is how disciples learn how to pray.

I was brought up in an environment that tried to harmonise the Gospels. I realise now that that approach misses the points that the individual Gospels are trying to make. I also see that in our own mission we should follow their example and re-express the Gospel in ways that are relevant to our audiences.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:19 am 
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Here are a couple of resources from bible.org to get you started without having to leave to go the store. :) If you haven't yet registered at the main bible.org site I encourage you to do so - simply register HERE I highly recommend using the same username and pw that you use here at the forum. Registration also gives you access to our users site where you can create a usergroup or blog :) You will also be able to use this log in information at http://net.bible.org our online NET Bible study resource center, you can access related articles while you read the bible :)

Bible Companion Handbook by Kenneth Boa

How to Study the Bible: For Beginners

Happy Reading :D

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:24 am 
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Wow,

Thanks everyone for all your advice. I didn't think this many people would actually respond at all. I have a lot of information to take in. For the most part, everyone is saying to start with the same books, so I think I have my starting point. And I know if I have any questions, all I have to do is ask and I do receive from all of you. Once again, thank-you all for your encouragement and advice.

Jeff


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:00 am 
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Duplicate post removed.


Last edited by Gideon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
COC #5


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:06 pm 
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I would start your study in the gospel of John since he, in my opinion, is the most theological of the four gospels. As you read, ask questions of the text and try to answer them by referring to other scriptures. One way of studying is comparing scripture to scripture (cross-referencing). I would write down things you observe in the text and keep them in a journal. You may want to look into study Bibles such as Ryrie's study Bible, the Criswell study Bible, etc. I would also recommend that you read for quality and not quantity; read and mediate on a verse that "jumps out at you."


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:58 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
kolabok21 wrote:Dr. Sproul recommends a starter list for people who have never read the Bible.

Quote:
Randy wrote: There is a lot of stuff in John that is greatly important to faith and practice. However, It's not necessarily "beginners" stuff.

It seems to me that the only thing you're getting off your chest is an over-reaction.


Hey, I just cut copied and pasted the article, not my words. Just for the record John is a deeply theological work rooted in a jewish flavor written to folks outside of Jerusalem, probably messianic jews of the dispora and gentiles of course
Besides sproul's starter list is not a bad way to get the historical theme down pat IMO, the main things are the plain things, the plain things are the main things

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 11:35 am 
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Hey Kola,

I had no problem with you or anyone else. My problem was with Sproul. I can understand introducing one synoptic for background. But I can't see The Gospel of John as being anything but second on the list. Too omit him from a long essential starting list?

Many evangelists start with a short "tract" called "The Book" (as I best remember)
That "book" is The Gospel of John. I agree with those evangelists. It's occasionally debated, but it's the only book in the NT that is explicitly evangelistic, by it's own account. In a debate between Dr Wilkin and Dr Bock at Dallas Theological Seminary, even Bock did not dispute this claim.

Again, I had no problem with anything YOU said! :-)

Peace
S

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 12:07 pm 
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Serendipity,
I'm not sure why Bock would simply agree (perhaps he felt it was a distraction from the debate? I don't know having not heard it...), but the commentaries I have used in studying John propose that there is significant debate about whether John was written to affirm the faith of believers or for those who had not heard the good news before. John's verbage does not seem to necessarily clarify this (despite a simplistic reading of his purpose).

I would also say that Luke (in Luke-Acts) seems an excellent candidate since it was written for "Theophilus" who had some teaching on Jesus, but to lay out things more clearly:
Quote:
Now many have undertaken to compile an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us,
2 like the accounts passed on to us by those who were eyewitnesses and servants of the word from the beginning.
3 So it seemed good to me as well, because I have followed all things carefully from the beginning, to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus,
4 so that you may know for certain the things you were taught. (Luk 1:1-4 NET - underlining mine for emphasis)
It is unclear that John was really doing anything significantly different concerning whomever he happened to be writing to (which John does not actually clarify).

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 12:20 pm 
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John 20:31 31 But these are recorded so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name. Context (NET)

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Behold, now is "THE ACCEPTABLE TIME,"
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 2:06 pm 
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I believe we all could get lost in the books of the book :) A life time indeed and for some already a life time of faithful study. John's gospel is genuinely a challenge to interpret on a scholarly level I suppose. If one digs deeper than superficial reading, one will encounter linguistics,grammar, audience(s) and historical/christological genre thats beggs as Jesus says, "come and see".. D.A.Carson's work on John from Pillar commentaries has been my go to text for this truly unique one of a kind gospel. And it is perhaps a standard in the evangelical community for conversion for new believers, since it is a book of signs, the greatest being, believing that Jesus is God...

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Jeremiah 29:13 You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 3:00 pm 
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Thanks for the recommendation of DA Carson's John. I love Carson and have been looking for any commentary he might have. He has fantastic insights. His "Basics for Believers" (an exposition on Philippians) is anything but basic.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 3:31 pm 
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Kola,

When I first became a Christian I sometimes debated atheists and the like in a very ungracious, immature way. I'm not proud of this but it's not my point. The thing I learned was that the more sophisticated opponents had no problem, in their minds, taking the bulk of the NT at face value and debunking it (in their minds). To them, they didn't need to discredit it to debunk it. There was one exception, they couldn't get around The Gospel of John. Their apologetic was to discredit John in any way they could.. Not any other book, just John!

Like most here, I believe in spiritial warfare... This tells me a lot....

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Behold, now is "THE ACCEPTABLE TIME,"
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 6:29 pm 
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Please know that all the Gospels/Acts are theological. I do not know on what scale John is seen to be more theological.

This also begs the question of why the Bible is being read. There are other reasons than to develop a theology.

As a catechism, I find Matthew to be clearest training for new Christians, once the context of Jesus as the Messiah and the audience setting in a Jewish Christian church is understood.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 7:10 pm 
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Serendipity wrote:
Kola,

When I first became a Christian I sometimes debated atheists and the like in a very ungracious, immature way. I'm not proud of this but it's not my point. The thing I learned was that the more sophisticated opponents had no problem, in their minds, taking the bulk of the NT at face value and debunking it (in their minds). To them, they didn't need to discredit it to debunk it. There was one exception, they couldn't get around The Gospel of John. Their apologetic was to discredit John in any way they could.. Not any other book, just John!

Like most here, I believe in spiritial warfare... This tells me a lot....


agree. John's gospel is an invitation to come and see who Jesus is, to those who look for something other is foolishness.

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Jeremiah 29:13 You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.

:book:


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 7:29 pm 
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John,
While it is possible that Matthew was addressed to a congregation of Jewish believers in Jesus as the Messiah...it has also been proposed that he was writing against forms of Judaism which had entered the Church in a polemical fashion. I would simply say that your reading of the original audience is only one of the possibilities (among several). It does appear that Matthew is fairly catechetical (or at least rather easily integrated into catechesis and thus may be part of the reason that it appears the Early Fathers seemed to have preferred Matthew).

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