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Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 6 posts ] 
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 Post subject: The very beginning
PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2010 10:20 pm 
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Faith: Seeking
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When I was young I was raised in a Lutheran Church. I loved going to church when I was a little girl. I got to see everyone and my family was very socially involved. As my brother and I got older, we became more busy and were not able to find our way to church as much. Eventually we stopped going. Now in our 20's, my brother has found his way back into the church but after attending a math and science focused academy for my schooling I have a hard time finding the logic in all of it. I understand that with so many things, especially God, you just need to have faith and I can live with that. However, I am a very concrete minded person and I have the hardest time wrapping my mind around the beginning, the creation story. Perhaps I just need it presented to me in a different way. Is there a way anyone can explain the facts of the beginning to me? I would love to find my way back to church and be the good Christian my Mother says she raised me as.

Thank you,
J Brooks


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 Post subject: Re: The very beginning
PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 11:18 am 
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Name of your church: RE Church of Christ
You did not pick an easy subject there are lots of alternatives. Differ from most other religions at least Judeo/Christians have a beginning story. In some way we have two beginning stories Gen 1 is one emphasizing one aspect and Gen 2 is another emphasizing a different aspect. If you just want to try and understand: “Why did God not make it obvious to the skeptic that He alone must have created everything?” That is a totally different question. An all powerful God could have done it anyway He wanted and in any time frame especially when we are dealing in God’s use of time. Maybe God took His “time” or maybe He did it all in a literal 6 earthly days, what we have is a description the earliest man could grasp and that is who it was written to (with the Bible, we are always reading other people’s mail.)
Sciences cannot proof or disproof anything about God, so yes God is a faith issue, but it really does not need that much faith. God has to provide an alternative explanation to avoid it being a knowledge issue. So man cannot just be dependent on his own wisdom/education/knowledge to scientifically know there has to be a God. Would it be fair to all the rest of the people that ever lived that “you” can “know” scientifically that there is a God and everyone else has had to depend initially on faith?
Would knowledge of God’s existence make you more reliant on your personal ability and less reliant on trusting God?
There are lots of practical logical reasons for our earthly purpose being centered around our need for faith, but that takes time to explain so is that your question?


Last edited by guykickinit on Wed Mar 10, 2010 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Changed spelling from Judo to Judeo


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 Post subject: Re: The very beginning
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 2:08 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:49 pm
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Location: Virginia
Faith: Christian
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Name of your church: StaffordBaptistChurch
You are not different than anyone else who questions the beginning. I would be writing a book here to explain my take on things and as being a Christian finding unity within the body on the beginnings. However we do tend to vary on our interpretation and understanding of the Genesis account, being that some will view Genesis as literal as in actually word for word as happening often called prose and others see the story as poetry with rhythmic structure and visual line content.
So first you would need to determine your position. May I suggest humbly in prayer first and foremost, letting the Holy Spirit guide you.

Secondly, there are a variety of books on the subject again depending on your point of view (this is all inclusive of young earth old earth). I would not be so caught up in the time but rather of a God before creation a term referred to as creatio ex nihilo that is God existed before anything. Another way of looking at it is the posit of the cosmological argument.

http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.c ... nt+for+God

At the end of the day, it is the only thing that makes sense. In the universe you see order not chaos

Look here for amazing pictures of God’s providence beyond human comprehension

http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/archivepix.html

_________________
Kola,

Jeremiah 29:13 You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.

:book:


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 Post subject: Re: The very beginning
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 11:13 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:43 pm
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Location: Yulee Fla.
Faith: Christian
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Name of your church: 1st Baptist of Jacksonville Fla
As I have gotten older now I see things from a different prospective than when I was younger, Sometimes me have to get off the fast pace life to really see things clear, kinda like when a horse wears blinders he only see whats directly in front of him as people sometimes we to must stop and take the blinders off so we can see the whole in panoramic view of Gods creation, I have been guilty of it my self and have to tell myself to stop and read and listen in your heart what God is telling you we get so caught up is this Hi Tech world of ours that we actually loose focus on the important things in life,

I have a daughter who is going through some changes in her life you know trying to juggle her work and also going for her Ph.D and its tough and I said the same to her, but I said I know that you given your life to Christ as a teenager you just lost your way with the college seen, but being interested is a good step to coming home again see I think God uses different ways to bring us back, I said to my daughter sweetie stop and watch the humming bird I said it might take a while but i said when you see him you will be in total amazement at such a beautiful sight and see God is calling for you to to come back and when you do then will you see at how creation came about "We must stand along on top of a mountain sometimes to see Gods mighty power at work".


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 Post subject: Re: The very beginning
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 12:06 pm 
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Posts: 245
Location: Hemet, Ca
Faith: Christian
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I would recommend a systematic theology book, and the Theology Program on this website. Those might answer some of the questions you have.

Remember when Peter told Jesus "where else am I gonna go... you're Christ!" (sort of)? Test the evidences of the secular opinions that put themselves against the knowledge of God. You will find the "checkmate" realization is that there is no other logical conclusion apart from a creator God. C.S. Lewis found himself in this confession of what he truly believed.

The prevailing scientific opinion is not without it’s problems. It argues that all forms of life evolved, but it has discovered no biological mechanism for evolution. This more than embarrasses the Evolutionists, it cripples their theory. They must postulate lengthy periods of time for chance mutations to produce new species or families. But the laws of thermodynamics make it rather doubtful that vast increases in time really improve the probability of evolution by chance. Then, too, if life existed on earth for millions of years, there would be far more fossil evidence for it; and, if all living forms evolved, the fossil record would include millions of transitory forms. No God- No Design Scientific opinion itself is suspect.
Rightly understood, the Genesis text does not present a scientific impossibility and can be accepted on literal grounds. A general harmony can be established between the geological column and the seven days of Genesis.
("Paradise to Prison- studies in Genesis", John Davis)

consider the odds. What are the odds of nothing + time = something?
We can fully comprehend that is is impossible for 2 + 2 to equal anything but 4. But what if, in time, it could equal something other than four? That's basically the foundations we are given from the prevailing atheist scientific opinion, which says our existence was self starting out of nothing.
On that matter, I don't know the exact odds; but I am convinced that the odds of a creator God speaking are better than nothing + nothing= existence.

Search for the answers. The evidences available to us are sufficient for those who are compelled to believe. Read the Bible daily, and check out that Theology Program.
-God Bless-

p.s- I forgot to mention the personal relationship with Christ. Reflect on your own life, and consider how he has been there and is there in the ways that only you could see.


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 Post subject: Re: The very beginning
PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:30 pm 
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Name of your church: TCC, Brown Deer
Hi J,
If you are a concrete minded person, then have you ever questioned the evidence for evolution?
The things they teach as truth in the public schools is a little bit scary to me, especially since I found out that it takes more faith to believe in evolution than it does in the creation story.

There have been many hoaxes, such as the jawbone they claimed was the earliest evidence ever found, and it was revealed to be the jawbone of a pig.
but I am not here to knock them, just asking you to look deeply into questioning their evidence.
I have also found a bit of circular logic, such as the "geographical column" that is taught as 'fact' in schools,
and the evidence against 'carbon 14' dating is much stronger than the evidence for it.
Can you guess why they don't 'carbon 14' date the stratification layers of the Grand Canyon?

The evidence for the Bible is extremely strong:

The Bible is approx. 1/3 prophesies. Of these prophesies, approx 80% have been fulfilled, to the letter.
(May I suggest you do a study on Daniel's 70 weeks?)
Found in Dan chapter 9, it has been found to be so accurate that it has been said to have been written after the fact.
It was written over 500 years before Christ, yet accurately predicts the day that He rode into Jerusalem on the colt.
Even the colt was prophesied elswhere in the Bible.
The United States is just over 200 years old, for comparison.

The Book of Daniel was also translated from Hebrew to Greek around 200 BC, so there is hard proof that it was not written after the fact.

Now, it is my strong conviction, after being a scoffer for years, that if I cannot accept the story of creation as found in Genesis as truth, then I must discount the entire Bible, because it says that it is God's Word, and God cannot lie.

There are difficult passages, yes.
But these only prompt me to study deeper and then I find out the answer is clear, and it is just God's wise ways to teach me and prove me wrong for doubting.

"That You may be justified in Your words,
And may overcome when You are judged." (Psa 51:4, David's prayer to God)

Any questions, please ask. I love to dig up answers.

keliy


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