Bible Forum

The Bible NETWork ~ Impacting the World for Christ one post at a time!

It is currently Tue May 21, 2013 6:04 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 4 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: God has a long nose
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 12:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:05 pm
Posts: 59
Location: Elkhart, IN
Faith: Christian
Ecclesiology/Denomination: Baptist
Name of your church: Zion Missionary Church
When the Bible reads God is slow to anger this is an idiom translated from the Hebrew that literally reads "God has a long nose." Why is that the idiom for God is slow to anger? Can anyone point me to some resources or Jewish scholars that can explain why this is?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God has a long nose
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 1:24 pm 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 11:08 am
Posts: 2788
Location: Upper Midwest
Faith: Christian
Ecclesiology/Denomination: Pentecostal (AoG)
Name of your church: Karlstad Assembly of God
The following may be a bit more than you were looking for but I thought I'd post it anyways as I thought it a great answer to your question. If you have any specific questions about what any of it means just let me know (or there are others here that can offer a better answer than I). This was recently discussed on B-Hebrew (a list group for those specializing or interested in Hebrew studies) on March 31, 2010 (IOW it can be checked in the archives on that date for anyone interested...if you wonder why certain comments don't make sense it is because it is part of a discussion among several participants...I hope it is alright with our Moderators that I'm posting this here. FWI...I am not James Spinti, but thought it pertinent to include who wrote the original reply to an identical question to the one posed here.):
Quote:
But, on the whole concept of 'ap: it is very frequent for the HB to use anthropomorphisms about divine beings, including YHWH.

Here is an excerpt from TWOT (via Accordance--BibleWorks gives the same text):

By the act of breathing, emotions can be expressed. Perhaps it was observed that the nose dilates in anger. God is said to be “‏אֶרֶךְ־אַפַּיִם‎“ (lit. “long of anger,” i.e. long before getting angry) in such passages as Ex 34:6; Num 14:18; Ps 86:15; Neh 9:17. The thought is that God takes a long, deep breath as he holds his anger in abeyance, A ruler is said to be persuaded by a display of forbearance, patience, i.e. “the long of breath” (Prov 25:15).
The main use of ‏אַף‎ is to refer to the anger of men and of God. This anger is expressed in the appearance of the nostrils. ‏אַף‎ gives specific emphasis to the emotional aspect of anger and wrath, whereas its synonyms and terms related to them give particular expression to other aspects.

Or, this from Jenni-Westermann (via Accordance):
Much more frequently ʾap indicates “anger,” with an easily understood development of meaning from “nose” to the gesture of “snorting” (in anger), which manifests itself in this body part (cf. Dhorme 80f.; Ug.: WUS no. 345; ? Aram. Cowley, no. 37.8; cf. DISO 21). In almost half the passages that treat human wrath, ʾap is associated with the verb → ḥrh “to become inflamed” (or the subst. ḥᵒrî; primarily in narrative literature: Gen 30:2; 39:19; 44:18; Exod 11:8; Num 22:27; 24:10; Judg 9:30; 14:19; 1 Sam 11:6; 17:28; 20:30, 34; 2 Sam 12:5; Isa 7:4; Psa 124:3; Job 32:2[bis], 3, 5; 2 Chron 25:10[bis]). A holy wrath seizes a person when the Spirit of Yahweh comes over him (Judg 14:19; 1 Sam 11:6). Wrath can turn away (šûb Gen 27:45); this is esp. the merit of discerning patterns of behavior (Prov 29:8).
4. (a) That the gods’ noses (Psa 115:6), indeed even Yahweh’s (Deut 33:10; 2 Sam 22:9, 16 = Psa 18:9, 16; on Ezek 8:17 txt? cf. Zimmerli, Ezek, Herm, 1:222, 244f.; the dual in Exod 15:8) can also be mentioned reflects the OT’s anthropomorphic conceptualization.
(b) Indeed, most instances of ʾap refer to divine anger (168x). All cases of the verb ʾnp qal/hitp. describe divine anger, as does the statement in the Mesha inscription (KAI no. 181.5; DISO 19; ANET 320b): the god Chemosh is angy with his people.

A quick look at the various lexica shows no related words in Hebrew or cognate languages to back up Karl's suggestion of a related root. And, the fact that it occurs in the Mesha stela (Moabite) makes me more than a little suspicious of a separate root.

Hope that helps,
James

________________________________
James Spinti
Marketing Director, Book Sales Division
Eisenbrauns, Good books for more than 30 years
Specializing in Ancient Near Eastern and Biblical Studies

_________________
Everyone is equal at the foot of the cross...just some are more equal than others.
Forum Code of Conduct
Bible.org Doctrinal Statement
rickwadholmjr.wordpress.com
iheartbarth.wordpress.com
bluechippastor.org
Twitter: @RickWadholmJr


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God has a long nose
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 4:49 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:05 pm
Posts: 59
Location: Elkhart, IN
Faith: Christian
Ecclesiology/Denomination: Baptist
Name of your church: Zion Missionary Church
So the gist of what they're saying is that the idiom comes from observing the nose dilate when someone gets angry. If they are patient they take deep long breaths and so the nose is said to be "long". Is that about right?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God has a long nose
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 5:09 pm 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 11:08 am
Posts: 2788
Location: Upper Midwest
Faith: Christian
Ecclesiology/Denomination: Pentecostal (AoG)
Name of your church: Karlstad Assembly of God
That is sort of the gist of it...although I think that proposal may be making more of the literalness than is necessary...much as we might say that someone who is sad looks "long in the face" or someone who is angry is "steaming". The literal does not convey what the culturally bound phrase really means. It may be possible that there is some actual connection to the "nose" (flaring? or taking long breaths?), but I don't personally think this is really the point and I find it to be somewhat of a stretch for a right way of understanding something that is an idiomatic expression. It is rarely of great value to explain the idioms of English (since they rarely have anything to do with our modern use of them) and I would say the same for other languages (Hebrew included). Not sure if that answers...

_________________
Everyone is equal at the foot of the cross...just some are more equal than others.
Forum Code of Conduct
Bible.org Doctrinal Statement
rickwadholmjr.wordpress.com
iheartbarth.wordpress.com
bluechippastor.org
Twitter: @RickWadholmJr


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 4 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group